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Interview for Nation of Israel: Russia, Ukraine, Iran, Israel, Angels and Mashiach

Given: Motzei Shabbat, March 12, 2022

This is an edited transcription of the interview for “Nation of Israel” conducted, principally, by Greg/Zvi Lauren, with Frank/Ephraim Zelenko participating.

Zvi: Thank you so much for accepting me in your home. It’s been a while. I’ve heard the rabbi, obviously, but haven’t seen him for the last two years since last I was in his home in Eretz Yisrael. He hasn’t been to Eretz Yisrael since Covid but here we are in Lakewood, New Jersey.

I want to get into this topic which has been on my mind and that of Frank Zelenko who’s listening in, this topic of ministering angels. Each nation has ministering angels that Ha’Shem assigns to each. If you look around the world there are all these countries that want to reclaim their “empireship” or “empirehood” and there’s an idea that these angels assert themselves throughout history.

R'Kessin: There are ten classes of malachim--"ministering angels” as they’re called. They act as intermediaries between mankind and the Ribono Shel Olam--G-D, between the physical world and Him. They allow the Ribono Shel Olam, though he directs things, literally, to conceal His presence. G-D reveals His “mindset” to them and it gives them the energy to perform their agency. G-D created this dimension of intermediaries. That’s what G-D wants. He doesn’t want to be directly involved with mankind. The only place we saw that was in the Beis Ha’Mikdash. We know that the shechina, the revelation of His presence, was there. Other than that, He acts though malachim. I don’t want to go into all of it but the malachim run the universe based on His orders. They are the functionaries of His Plan, bringing about and carrying out all His will. He communicates with them in the sense that they know what He wants, which is interesting because it’s not like they have a direct relationship with G-D--no. What He wants reveals itself to their minds and they have all the energy they need to carry out the task. That’s what their overall responsibility is. There are other tasks they are given, the carrying out of the physical laws, how the universe runs and so on.

But as far as ministering angels representing G-D, it’s like every person has a malach, a defender, because a person is always being judged and which many times is frequent. The angel is a sort of defense attorney, a good advocate for the person. Just as every person has such an advocate, every nation, collectively, has one as well to represent it especially when actions have to be determined or decided as to what will happen to that nation. We’ve seen it many times, for example, Egypt at Krias Yam Suf--splitting of the Reed Sea. The angel of Egypt tried to defend it.

Malachim have different tasks and different levels. We find that by Shimshon / Samson, the angel appeared to his parents to instruct them how to raise Shimshon. He was not just a “strong man’ but a shoresh--root soul of Yosef. Unfortunately, he became attracted to Delilah, to women, and erred in that sense and so became disqualified. But he was a remarkable person, an incredible person. We look upon him as a kind of “strongman” a sort of “Mr. Universe.” Really, he was a root soul of the Mashiach ben Yosef and had incredible ruach ha’kodosh as such. The one who instructed his parents on how to raise him was a malach.

There are ten levels of malachim. They don’t have free-will but some do, not to choose between good and evil but right and wrong. They make mistakes and are punished for them. The classic one is Raphael who was sent to save Lot and his daughters, and so on, and he made the mistake of saying, “I’m going to destroy the city” when what he should have said was that G-D would destroy it. For that he, an angel, was punished, being excluded from a Heavenly place for awhile. The higher eschalons of malachim can choose between right and wrong but not good versus bad because, for them, there is no “good and evil.” For them, to think there is an alternative to “good” is impossible being, as they are, so close to G-D. To think there is an alternative to G-D is, to them, impossible because they’re with G-D all the time. The presence of G-D, to them--we cannot comprehend. They are servants of the King.

There are angels that are in charge of the physical laws of the universe, actually in control of that-- like gravity. Gravity has a malach. They actually create gravity--we don’t know how-- in whatever kabbalistic ways. What’s interesting is that their task can be altered. If you know a Divine name and go through the proper procedure--that’s a study in itself--and when you meditate on this, you can command them to do what you want done and they respond. This is called “White Magic,” an area of study as to what Divine Names they accede to. If you have a grasp of that, you can command them to do things for you that can actually supersede physical nature; that’s what “White Magic” really is.

There are all kinds of shemes, the rebbe and the RaMCHaL, for example. Rav Moshe Zakuto wrote a sefer--book all about this: how to disappear, how to cure any disease, what names to meditate on. In fact, it’s two volumes; that’s how much stuff is in there. You have to be careful, obviously, but if you know what you're doing and follow the right instructions, you can command malachim to do your bidding and deviate from their assigned task. It’s an entire chochma--wisdom.

There is an interesting interface between malachim and man. One of the interesting things is that you must be careful because if you do the wrong thing, if you anger the malach, you’re in a bad situation and the angel can do you great harm. So, obviously, you must know what you’re doing. I’m just bringing down that there exists this kind of phenomenon.

Interesting to know that we have five parts to our souls, from the “bottom up.” They are: nefesh, ruach, neshama, chaya and yechida. Those are the five names that represent five different parts of the soul. They are connected, like a chain. The reason we have five parts is because each part is connected to one dimensions of reality. There are obviously five dimensions: (Olam) Asiya is connected to the nefesh. There’s Yetzira to which ruach is connected. There’s briyah which is the third dimension connected to neshama--which is also an individual term. Then there’s Atzilut that chaya is connected to. Then there’s what’s called “Adam Kadmon” which is Olam ha’Ba--Future World to which your yechida is connected.

We have no consciousness of four of them. If you know how to open up the consciousness of a particular aspect of your neshama, for instance, ruach. If you know how to “open up” you can actually see into olam Yetzira. You can’t go there, but your consciousness would expand and you can look into olam Yetzira. If that’s the case, you could speak to the residents of that place, those malachim. There are malachim in each olam--world. If you know what to do, you could open your consciousness and look into those worlds and speak to angels! Isn’t that fascinating!

That phenomenon of being able to look into olam Yetzira and speak to malachim is called “ruach ha’kodesh.” That’s the real “ruach ha’kodosh” and was done most famously by Rabbi Akiva and the four people in pardes who went into that world. That’s why they were able to envision it.

Just as an aside, we can all address olam Yetzira. Why? That is the secret of Shabbos. On Shabbos, what G-D has done--without getting into the whole thing--is allow us to open our consciousness to interact with olam Yetzira. What does that mean? It’s only a partial opening. You can’t see into that world but you can feel it. It’s a “half” ruach ha’kodesh that happens on Shabbos. That‘s the feeling you get when Shabbos comes. Ever wonder what it is you are feeling? It’s the spiritual presence of G-D in olam Yetzira because part of your consciousness, part of your ruach that is connected to Yetzira is opened but you can only feel some of it. That’s the reason why we sing “Shalom Aleichem malchei ha’shares”--welcome angels of the Most High. What do I have to do with malachim? On Shabbos, my ruach is partially open to Yetzira which is their residence. If I’m connected with them, even partially, I can greet them with “Shalom aleichem, malachei ha’shares.” Isn’t that interesting?. There’s a halachic outcome based on what Shabbos is. So, we do interface with malachim. There are all kinds of different strategies that a person can perform in terms of malachim. I imagine that’s what you’d like to know.

Zvi: How does that all play into what is happening with the nations since we’re assuming that every nation has a malach assigned to it. In terms of current events, how does it play into it, for instance, when Iran wants to assert itself and Turkey wants to assert itself, Russia wants to…..

Frank: Could I add a caveat to that question? I wish I could recall precisely…..the angel Gavriel comes to Daniel and--correct me if I’m mistaken--says “Sorry I’m late, but the malach of Persia wouldn’t allow me to get to you so that’s why I’m a couple weeks late to answer you. Then he added, “I had to get Michael to help me to get past the malach of Persia to deliver G-d’s message. So, my question is, how could one malach who does Ha’Shem’s will interfere with another malach who is also doing Ha’Shem’s will. That’s the crux of my question.

R'Kessin: Angels themselves have no power but they do have power of kitrugim--prosecutorial actions in the court. The malach of Persia entered a plea in the Heavenly Tribunal and plead successfully to delay the message’s delivery. Michael was called upon to intervene. Eventually, the requested delay terminated. That is their power. You can’t simply interfere, can’t just do what you want to do. It’s all run based on justice, judgement. That is how a malach can affect the affairs of nations. That’s the main idea that applies to all the nations of the world. They, in some way, can defend their respective nations and, somehow, mitigate judgements. That is what goes on. There’s a tremendous amount of judicial activity happening now.

Also, remember that in the Torah there are only seventy nations though many of them seem similar but there could be one malach representing several nations because their root neshamos--souls number seventy. It’s a whole realm that, kabbalistically, can interfere with judicial process.

Zvi: Right now, we’re looking at Russia’s attack of Ukraine while China is looking at Taiwan, India had an incident with Pakistan. It’s not like one nation is attacking a totally different nation. It’s not civil war but it seems like internal wars, like there’s a malach that would be attached to these nations and it’s as if he’s fighting with himself. He’s asserting himself in that space, I guess?

R’Kessin: Within every given nation, it’s a nation with all kinds of individuals. Take America. It has divided itself in two different camps. One camp is the “evil of Esav,” as Edom. So, you have Americans who are evil. Then you have Americans who are basically good. So, within that nation itself, who dominates? That’s why you can have, in any given nation, tremendous internal conflict.

Ukraine could be part of Russia or part of the evil of Esav. Who dominates? I’d mentioned in a recent shiur that, as ruthless as Putin is, he’s moral. It sounds funny, but even a rasha--rogue, evil-doer can be good in certain aspects of his character and values. Is anyone totally evil?--probably not. If a Nazi were feeding his parakeet, he has a merit. If he says “hi” to his father, that’s honoring one’s parent. No one is totally evil though some may come close to it, but not really. As a result, there are differences in evil. Putin does have the merit that he’s for morality. Even though he would kill you if you stand in his way, the morality he is advocates puts him, morally, over the West. Though the West is, in general, good, when America is decreed to be punished, which they have been, under a terrible decree to be punished, the one that G-D picked is Putin because he has a merit, being pro-morality. Even though, in some ways, he’s bad news, America has to be punished, as they’re being. Putin was picked to do that because he has merit whereas America is a terribly depraved country. They are destroying the world’s morality. So, one nation may have a merit to punish the other. All depends on the spiritual structure of that nation.

The problem with Ukraine is that it has bad stuff associated with it. Ukraine is terribly anti-Semitic, terrible. Someone told me that 64% of Ukrainians are anti-Semitic. Some say they don’t see that but, in general, its history is terrible. Going back to the Khmelnytsky massacres, they killed almost half of European Jewry at that time--Poland and Hungary. It’s stuff of legend what they did with the Nazis in WW2, Babi Yar in Ukraine. I heard that even the Nazis were appalled at the viciousness of the Ukrainians. Ostensibly, they said, “We like what you’re doing in killing Jews but you’re very disorganized. Let us show you how to do it in a more organized way.” Do you believe this? That’s how bad the Ukrainians were, and also the Lithuanians. Ukrainians are, obviously, being revisited. It called “payback time.” They’re literally being destroyed. We’re not looking at hardship. We’re looking at destruction of their civilization. Two million have run away as of now and it’s only the beginning of the war. Forget about their industry and so on. Ukraine slaughtered the Jews for what? They are also incredibly corrupt, one of the most on the planet.

You have to remember, it’s like what is said about G-D’s justice, comparing it to the churning of a millstone, a ten-ton stone that was used to crush the wheat to separate the chafe from the kernels. They say, “The millstone of G-D grinds exceedingly slow but exceedingly fine.” It takes time. A nation isn’t judged right away, certainly not every day, but there are times when a nation is, suddenly, “on the docket,” in the heavenly tribunal. Then G-D affects that nation because that’s when the angels are back and forth and the decree is given. It’s not that G-D tells Putin to do what he does, but G-D allows him to do it because Putin’s willi conforms to the Divine Agenda.

Ukraine is under a terrible decree for what it’s done to the Jews and the general corruption that defines it. It’s known what the Ukraine is, so they’re being destroyed. Some of the reports….you can’t believe what’s happening there. Imagine a person picks himself up, he and his entire family, and has to run away. Imagine a lifetime of building up a business, of kids in school, of communities; it’s all life. Now, all he has is a suitcase and that’s the end of his life and nobody knows when he’ll be able to return if there’s anything to return to. We’re watching the destruction of Ukraine.

It’s under a terrible indictment, but so is America. Its punishment, which I’ve talked about many times, is due to its having become an incredibly depraved nation. LGBTQ is the “name of the game.” The whip of G-D is Biden who is destroying America. G-D allowed America to be fooled. Covid allowed Biden to win by allowing him to hide out in the basement. He’s destroyed the economy that Trump spent his presidency building. Covid was a means for G-D to put Biden in to destroy America. People are going crazy with what’s happening in America. You’ll notice this is very similar to what’s happened to Ukraine. Thank G-D, nobody’s having to run away from America because the enemy is not outside America--the enemy IS America. It’s Biden (his administration), the Democratic Party, the progressives, the liberals, wiping out America and they’ve got another three years to do more damage.

We are watching tremendous decrees against the entire world because we are near the End. As we get closer and closer to the End, G-D has to “balance the books.” Ukraine, the U.S., and even Europe are all under indictment. Everybody’s walking around with an existential fear of death, waiting for WW3. They think WW3 is about to break out, or just one more mistake and the red button will be pushed. People are in real fear. That’s pachad maves--fear of death, a means for kappara--atonememt for the sins of mankind.

I’ve given a shiur in which I mentioned something very important, that Zelensky made a terrible mistake, did something absolutely idiotic. Putin never threatened to take over Ukraine. All he wanted was that Ukraine should not have missiles, as part of NATO, pointed at him. Whether you agree with him or not, he has a right to be concerned with what he thinks is a threat to Russia. That’s his right. You may disagree thinking that it really wasn’t a concern, but what Zelensky should have done is express disagreement but honor the fear and not threaten to join NATO. He could have thought to wait until sometime in the future when Putin would be gone or whatever, but not pick a fight with Putin. It’s insane to have done it. The man’s an idiot. I hate to use that word but he’s responsible for Ukraine’s destruction. I hate to say that because if the non-Jews of Ukraine realize that, there will be the biggest anti-Semitic movement Ukraine has ever seen. He should have bided his time. Like I said, if you’re in a room with an 800-pound gorilla and that gorilla is blocking the door and there’s another way of getting out--guess what! You don’t fight with the gorilla; you leave the room. You get out. You must know which battles to fight. Look at the price Ukraine is paying. That’s the price you pay for appointing a comedian to be president, someone with no experience and no brains. Many have died already because of his ridiculous mistake.

G-D has all of this planned. He knows and He’s using it for His agenda which, I believe, is to punish Ukraine for the terrible slaughter of Jews and its own corruption. When a nation is corrupt, how does it run? Do you know how many people suffer, how many injustices are done in such an environment? This is not the way to run a country. So, this is part of the punishment. The judgement has reached Ukraine. The millstone has stopped at Ukraine and, boy, are they being destroyed!

It's all part of the End. Now, Putin himself has become anathema to the whole world. Nobody will have anything to do with him. They all view him as a monster. It seems very possible that he himself is ending his career.

The whole world is involved in the punishment. Right behind Russia is China. If we thought we had enough with Russia, China is much worse, more dangerous, because it’s the second greatest economy on earth. We really have to worry in terms of what China is doing. Russia will never take over, never surpass the economy of the United States. China can because they are an economic powerhouse.

The world is in economic turmoil, which is amazing. The world went from Covid on a global scale, world-wide turmoil fraught with anxiety, and, out of nowhere--almost--there’s a new global threat called “Putin.” All of this is because we’re approaching the End of Time.

Zvi: How do you explain this kind of--like I asked before--desire of these empires seemingly at the same time to rise back to their former glory. They all want to do this at the same time.

R’Kessin: The Zohar says that, at the End of Time, G-D will bring back many of the evildoers who were rulers of the nations, will bring them back as incarnations called “gilgulim.” Obviously, the nations are being resurrected to complete their evil and then G-D destroys them. Yeah, it’s replay of what happened in the past except, now, G-D is punishing them, creating colossal upheaval in the world. It’s like the final scene of a play, the final act when all the characters return to the stage and then the play ends. It’s almost like G-D conducts the reenactment of all the evil that took place over thousands of years. He’s bringing them back to this generation and wants to smash them all and end it--see?

I once mentioned that we have almost eight billion people on the planet so maybe, if you look at the accumulation of mankind over the thousands of years--I think the world reached its first billion in 1810 or something like that--with there now being eight billion in only 150 years. It’s almost as though everybody’s got to come back to witness the End.

Zvi: I think it was a week ago that Bennett almost went--I guess you can call it “shuttle diplomacy”--to Putin to meet with Zelensky--or phoned him, I’m not sure. Is that wise for any prime minister of Israel to do? Where do you see Israel in all of this?

R’Kessin: In terms of Bennett, he has tremendous problems because he is being blamed and has to be very careful. He needs Putin because he’s (Israel) bombing (Iranian positions) in Syria and he doesn’t want to anger Putin who’s allowing Israel to do it. The last thing Bennett wants is to antagonize Putin. On the other hand, Israel gets much of its produce, its wheat, computers, know-how, from--believe it or not--Ukraine, so Israel can’t afford to anger Ukraine either. They’re stuck between a rock and a hard place. Maybe the best thing to do is say, “I’m really for peace and will try to make peace between both of you so both (Putin and Zelensky) can say Bennett tried. That way, neither side will be angry with Israel. It’s a compromise, an interesting one in terms of being able to escape the wrath of both nations.

Regarding Israel, you see something very important, that evil dominates because the prosecution for evil (the Satan) is making demands. You can imagine his saying, “Wait a minute! This world is a terrible place. I want my guys to succeed; they deserve to succeed.” Israel, therefore, has to deal with the scourge that, since ancient times, is known as the “Eirev Rav”--Mixed Multitude. Today’s representation of them are: Reform and Conservative and Reconstructionist Judaism--all these guys, these Jews trying to destroy Judaism. That also takes place at the End of Time. It’s the domination of evil for Israel. Israel too has its share of upheaval.

It’s all happening together and in rapid succession. That’s scary. These kinds of things used to happen every hundred years. Now they happen every hundred hours. As we get closer to the End….here’s an analogy. Before the dawn, it’s always darkest. That’s why it is so dark now and events seem to proceed quickly because we are literally right at the break of dawn.

Zvi: What about Iran? Are we just being distracted by Ha’Shem?

R’Kessin: The problem with Iran is that Iran has merit. What’s the merit? His son, Cyrus or Koresh, allowed the building of the Second Temple. That’s a tremendous merit. So, they are allowed to come back and resume their domination but they choose to do it in a bad way. They are, really, Yishmael. They are Moslems though they used to be Persians, Zoroastrians. Because they have this merit--even an evil person has to have merit In order to dominate and punish somebody else--they can be this force in the End.

As I’ve mentioned many times, there’s a “Yalkut Shimoni” midrash that says that the last war that Israel will face is with Iran--"Poras.” They will get nuclear weapons which I felt even thirty years ago they’d get because the midrash says that they will threaten the world. Without nuclear weapons, you cannot threaten the world. So, they will but it will come to naught, but they’re doing it because they have that merit. That war, or the possibility of that war between Iran and Israel, will be the last war and the midrash ends with the fact that a Divine voice is heard to say, “higiah zman geulaschem”--the time of your Redemption has arrived. This is the war that’s to take place between Iran and Israel, is the last war. Then the Redemption starts.

Zvi: Frank, do you have any questions?

Frank: You mentioned a few times a Zohar that talks about two opinions, two Tana’im, as to when the resurrection of the dead will begin, how long the process takes. One of the rabbis says that it takes 214 years and the other says 210 years. My question is, and I’ve been asking around, is there anybody in chazal that doesn’t hold by the 6000-year timeline, that maybe we go on longer.

R’Kessin: The Gemara explains that the world will last 6,000 years because each millennium (in our time-frame) is equivalent to one day in G-D’s. It says that “a thousand years in our eyes is equivalent to one day in Yours.” The world was created in six days so, therefore, the world will last 6,000 years which is G-D’s “day” equivalent to a thousand days (for us). In the 7,000th year, which is equivalent to Shabbos, is the world ends. That’s equivalent to the Gregorian calendar year, 2240. After that, the world begins the process of transformation into the Future World. Everybody in the Gemara says several times that the world will only last 6000 years, equivalent to the six days of Creation. The Zohar presents--and this is the argument--that resurrection begins 210 versus 214.

According to the one who says it will take 214 years, we are going to see mashiach in four years. That’s why things are happening so quickly. It’s a tremendously accelerated process. That process begins after Mashiach ben David comes so, therefore, according to the less stringent conclusion--210 years--the Mashiach ben David comes by the year 2030 which is less than eight years. But, before Mashiach ben David, we must have the time period of Mashiach ben Yosef. I’ve spoken about that extensively. Therefore, we are very, very close because, as close as we are to Mashiach ben David, we have to have Mashiach ben Yosef first. That’s why all of this is happening with incredible speed.

Frank: I fully agree. It obviously makes the most sense and is certainly clear that the vast majority of rabbonim--rabbis see it that way too, especially the greatest, the Vilna Gaon and his students. I got very upset months ago when I heard--this is second, third, fourth person (hearsay)--a rav saying about another rav, that another rav said that, even if it’s the year 6,001 and mashiach will come, yet I’m still gonna go to shul and still gonna do this and that …. I mean, I was just wondering if---that’s the first time it ever entered my mind--this idea about the 6,000 years is an absolute universal (consensus) among chazal. It certainly seems to be the vast majority (understanding).

R'Kessin: There is one person, Rabbeinu Bahaye who holds that the world will go through seven cycles, each one being 6,000 years, and that we’re only on the fourth cycle. But the Ari (Arizal) holds that it’s not true and there’s only one 6,000-year cycle.

Frank: I’ll take the Ari’s opinion. (laughter)

R’Kessin: Yes. The Ari is probably one of the greatest mekubalim of all time. I wouldn’t let it worry you.

Zvi: Do you think we’re in the phase of Mashiach ben Yosef now?

R’Kessin: Yes, we’re in the Mashiach ben Yosef phase.

Zvi: Could it be a short period of time that we’re in the phase of Mashiach ben Yosef and then, right away--Mashiach ben David?

R’Kessin: What will happen in his time is a great number of miracles. Once you have miracles, it doesn’t take long for the world to change. There’s an interesting Gemara “Yerushalmi,” “Maaser Sheini,” which says, and they bring proof, that the Beis Ha’Mikdash ha’Shlishi--the Third Temple will descend from Heaven before Mashiach (ben Yosef). That’s very interesting because most people are of the mindset that the Third Temple, which is the heavenly one, will happen after Mashiach ben David but the Gemara says it will happen before.

What does “before” mean? It means that it descends during the time of Mashiach ben Yosef. Can you imagine, all of a sudden, a Beis Ha’Mikdash is descending from heaven and landing on the spot of the mosque! What do you think the world is going to do? They’re going to go out of their minds because that’s proof positive that the Jews have been right. I guarantee you…How many people will be unbelievably frightened, especially those who hate Jews and have harmed Jews, because they will realize what’s going to happen to them---justice. This tells you that the Beis Ha’Mikdash will come down from heaven….now. That’s what’s going to start the world to understand the truth. It’s obviously irrefutable once that happens. You have to get ready for incredible miracles. It’s going to come out of nowhere and be miraculous. All this will be supernatural, just like Egypt was supernatural but to a much greater degree.

Zvi: I keep hearing, davka, that he (Mashiach ben Yosef) doesn’t necessarily have to be a person. It could be….

R’Kessin: That’s incorrect.

Zvi: It’s a person…it’s a person…yeah. What is that based on, davka ben Yosef; I’m just curious.

R’Kessin: Even the Gemara holds that it’s a person. There’s one argument that says that he died, but the Vilna Gaon, the RaMCHaL, and mekubalim say “no,” that he should have died…we’re not getting into that, but G-D changed the decree and, instead, he will live.

Zvi: So you’re saying there’s Mashiach ben Yosef walking among us today and there’s also Mashiach ben David walking around, two different people?

R’Kessin: Correct.

Frank: Can I have one more question, guys? I’m sorry to interrupt.

Zvi: That’s ok. One more and we’ll wrap it up.

Frank: You set it up perfectly when you mentioned that there are opinions that say that the Beis Ha’Mikdash is gonna descend from the sky. I saw an interview, a clipping, that someone had from an old article--I think it was from the “Forward” or one of the other Jewish-type newspapers in which they were interviewing Rav Aharon Soloveichik in Chicago. I don’t recall the context of the conversation but, somehow, I think the interviewer asked him if he believes in life in outer space or something of that nature. His answer--and this was confirmed by asking his son--was that: well, we have the ishim---angels called the “ishim” which fly around the outer atmosphere and out above the atmosphere. He said something--I’m not sure, I’m not using his exact wording--but that was the meaning of it and so I guess my question is, if that’s the case, have you ever heard such an idea? Are these “ishim angels” involved with the nations? I know that’s a loaded question so, if it’s too crazy, then just ignore it but I was just really curious.

R'Kessin: I mentioned that there are ten classes of angels. Ishim are the lowest class. That is why they are called “ishim” because they are one level above “ish”--man. But they are still angels and are still ethereal beings, not humans. They are angels of olam Asiya--World of Action, not Yetzira--World of Formation. Even Asiya has many dimensions. It has seven different “chambers” or realities. It means that they inhabit the spiritual aspect of the world of Asiya which is the lowest of the realities that there is, but they are still angelic. They are not creatures of outer space because outer space is physical. It’s just that it’s “outer;” an angel is not physical. The definition of an angel is a being that, if they were to remain the way they are in terms of their nature and don’t put on the garb of a human, you cannot, in any way, interface with them. That’s what an angel is. There’s no way to interface unless they assume the garb of a human which is, obviously, what they do at times. They are essentially angelic, spiritual. There’s no way to detect them. It’s different than a ghost that is the reality of a neshama--soul that has to wander the earth. Since he was physical, he’s restricted to the physical universe. That’s why he’s a ghost. An angel is not a ghost.

As far as I’m concerned, there are no outer space creatures unless you’ve seen too many movies. It’s not proof but there are many scientists that have come to the conclusion that we--mankind--are the only living thing in the entire universe. According to scientists, there’s the “Goldilocks” theory which says there are constants of nature that have to be exact to the 30th decimal place or a world cannot exist. I’m not going into that but there’s some very good reading material about that. The main idea is that there is nothing else and there are many scientists that have come to that conclusion. Scientists, Seti, all these guys, try to contact outer space beings but no one has ever received anything from anybody. Most planets don’t conform to the “Goldilocks” principle (wherein all conditions must be perfect, precise) so people realize that the probability of having another Earth is beyond comprehension. I’m not getting into the topic of the physical constants--it’s impossible. There is nothing outside of this earth that’s “living.” That’s it.

You should know one thing. Even if there were, it would not contradict Torah. The real question you’d have to ask is: what’s their job in the purpose of Creation? That’s all you have to ask. There’s a grasshopper in India. What’s its purpose? It’s the same mystery. What is the purpose of all living forms? In truth, there is no other planet that could sustain life. In terms of probability, it’s inconceivable. Mathematically, it’s impossible. I don’t know what Rav Ahren held but I can just tell you that ishim are angelic, not physical.

Frank: Maybe it’s like you said; sometimes they take on some sort of physical form just to interact with us.

R’Kessin: Yeah, yeah, that could be, yeah. Just like the malach by Shimshon. They obviously took on a physical form (like the) the ones who went to Avraham Avinu. They took on physical form and can discard that physical garb and revert back to the malachim that they really are.

Zvi: Without getting into a long discussion about it, Frank and I have been talking about real stories of--speaking about nuclear weapons--navy guys--you probably heard about this--that in the 60’s or 70’s when nuclear facilities or weapons were literally deactivated by some entities and maybe--Frank, maybe you can enlighten us about it. We were thinking that it might be these malachim, or these beams….

Frank: I’m going to say this really quick and I have to qualify this, yeah, so you don’t become nuts. When I was in college, I was taking one of these prerequisite classes and I had to write a paper on the subject I’m uncomfortable with or just something that I’m not interested in so you pick a subject “out of a hat.” My subject was “UFOs.” I didn’t have much interest in it. I thought it was kind of strange but, in the course of my research to write this paper, I came upon a couple of interesting things. Most of it was crazy, but a few were interesting. One of them was this case with a nuclear missile launch officer who was assigned to Malmstrom Air Force Base in Montana in 1967. He testified--and I actually had a chance to speak to him for a few minutes on the phone--about when he and another officer were put in a special bunker very, very deep underground in the earth where they control a launch mechanism. He had control of over twenty intercontinental ballistic missiles--1967. He got a phone call from his chief of security saying that there was a kind of orange-red oval-shaped sort of thing hovering above the missile silo which then started darting from one silo to the other--like instantaneously, like instantaneous acceleration--all that kind of stuff, and the missile officer said that while he was on the phone listening to this report, his missiles started going into a “no-go” mode, meaning that they were closing down so that he would not be able to launch them had he been ordered to.

Afterward, I saw that this was a documented case. He used the Freedom of Information Act to present documents. There was a press conference and all this kind of stuff and there’s been a series of other officers who have come forward with similar accounts with similar documentation. Since then, Russian nuclear-missile-launch officers have also come forth with that kind of testimony, claiming the same phenomena. That’s what Greg (Zvi) is referring to.

R'Kessin: This is UFO stuff. If you really want to know more about this, go to Roswell. That’s the place.

I want to tell you something which is true of mankind. Whenever there are stories, there will always be stories that seem supernatural. Nobody has ever seen these things. I would imagine that, if there are extraterrestrial beings, they would have appeared, have made their presence known by now. Why the cloak-and-dagger stuff? So, in truth, most of these things have been explained but there is a percentage for which there is no explanation.

Frank: I think it’s the malachim. I think that’s, perhaps, the way in which malachim interface with mankind every now and then.

R’Kessin: You’re entitled to have that theory but I don’t buy it. What else am I gonna say about UFO’s?

Zvi: Is there anything else you would want to share with the audience with regard to current events, anything to look forward to that would be on a positive note?

R’Kessin: The main thing, and what I believe, is that we are in a redemption process that has started. I have many lectures on this. If anyone wants, they can go to the site: “” where I have many lectures, all with transcription. You can read them online or print then out. I’m also on TorahAnytime. Altogether, there are approximately 400 lectures altogether including my YouTube channel: Torah Thinking.

The redemption process has begun. I believe that America will change. G-D seems to be destroying the evil that He has permitted to dominate, Biden and Company. G-D seems to be destroying a lot of stuff. I think we are at that point of what’s called “balancing the books“and are very close to Redemption.

The main thing is to hold on. Just remember that G-D will not destroy a world that He created because mankind is crazy. He’s not going to do that. G-D has an agenda, a plan, and that agenda is, ultimately--like it says in the Torah which is the only document that reveals the truth--to bring a messiah, a messianic era which is the ultimate utopia of this world. After this world ceases to exist, there will be a Future World which will be eternal. I believe that process of bringing in the messianic era has begun and we are now looking at the end of the domination of evil, slowly. In the end, mankind will be redeemed, especially the Jewish people who will be the supreme nation. There will be peace, a tremendous amount of blessing, and spirituality. The evil of this world will finally cease to exist and the reversion will take over. The entire earth will be blessed.

Zvi: Big “amen” to what you are saying. Thank you very much. Thank you, Frank.

Frank: Rabbi, thank you so much. We love you so much. We listen to you all the time and it’s a great honor.

R’Kessin: I hope I’ve met your expectations.

Zvi: Exceeded and, to quote you, “we’ll see what happens.”

Frank: Far exceeding….


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